“A Declaration of War” — Pastor Geoff Patterson Examines the Unity Document






10/27/18 - #18

That, and the built-in social sanction of hierarchical social structures (bad barrels) that potentiate and light the fuse of that social time bomb, I would say, Dennis.

Some of us (bad apples) are accidents waiting to happen.

Ellen White has a polarized personality. I would say that people, like iron filings, gravitate to whichever EGW pole best fits their exogenous ligand. (Hey, I like to mix metaphors, too!)

This happens with the Bible also. It may be an accidental or intended feature God allows and uses to develop our consciousness, I don’t know.

Thanks for the interesting horse link! I’ve spent a lot of time reading and watching material on humane horse training. Would love to talk more about this later!

Anyway, maybe nobody listens to us old coots, but if you want to find your pack, you have to howl.

Or…you just have to howl before you die, pack or not…

@Red :rofl: (veggiemeat)

(reliquum) #64

What if it taint vegemeat?
Some roast beast might do the trick…


10/27/18 - #20

You guys are killing me… :rofl:

(reliquum) #66

Cassie changed her appellation?

(Red Livingstone) #67

Nah… just don’t eat any veggiemeat or vegemeat in the near future!

On a serious note, the information about the baboons was fascinating.


10/27/18 - #21

That’s MS Cassandra Perelandra to you guys, thank you very much! Hmmph!

(Elmer Cupino) #69

Only when the behaviors are repetitive and impairs interpersonal relationships does it warrant the consideration of an addictive behavior.

Are you a member of the Lake Forest Academy Church?

(Harry Allen) #70

Thanks, @Cassie.

I hope I write about it, too. Just fascinating outcomes. Thanks for the male cichlid fish link, also.

As for the headship writing, I appreciate your kind words. I also appreciate @kevindpaulson’s responses.

I’d not written on headship, much, before. So, a lot of that was completely new for me. Something in Kevin’s responses and non-responses helped clarify the issue. I mean this in the sense that actors do when they say—with no disrespect to Kevin—that you can’t have a good movie hero without an amazing villain.


(Steve Mga) #71

Dennis –
Are you planning to join another Denomination? Or just stay at home?
One can always move their membership to another Denomination.
Have seen that done, as long at the person was baptized sometime
in one’s lifetime.


It is important to avoid misunderstandings and to make clear what you say in a given post. Below you can find a couple of (purposefully silly and ridiculous) examples of how this could be misinterpreted though hopefully not what you meant.

Your statements imply that their is a racist element to the genetic represenation to to this pastoral/support staff and has some kind logical connection to the planetary locale of other people make decision that impact one another.

Or do you mean…

As many who are worthy are called…I mean as many who are worthy, so long as they are called based on a artificial mathematically based racially representation of the overall members at a particular time that is acceptable to whomever, are called…

Of course why stop there with the pastoral and support staff after all you might as well keep going with the all of the other activities of the church that require human involvement and for that matter apply this also to the members and visitors to this church and make sure that they are also represented by a particular racial appropriate represented number…

Just remember I am being purposefully silly and ridiculous as an example of how one can be misunderstood.


Simon, what does this have to do with my comment as I don’t recall opposing James and Ellen White in their work? Also it is true that I moved West however I am at a loss as to what this quote has to do with my comment…:wink:

I was only expressing my happy experience of re-examining my self in light of new information…


I am a ‘web member’ of the Forest Lake Church.

When I learned of what was being planned at the 2018 Annual Council about a month early, I tried to contact the ‘web pastor’ about having my membership removed from the SDA church, but got no response. As I was busy and pooped from working overtime away from home, I let it go.

Then after I watched the October 14 Annual Council rape of the ‘faith of Jesus’ by SDA ‘commandments of God’-keepers from my motel room, while constantly texting with my wife who was watching, and often weeping, alone, 700 miles away back home . . . I immediately contacted an unordained woman, instead (the church clerk at Forest Lake), who got right on my request to drop my SDA membership as well as my wife’s added request to do so.

That female clerk also clearly believed in ‘Christ our Righteousness’, just as my wife and I do, but the apostate SDA GC clearly does not, or they would not have crucified – humiliated – the faithful, trusting Lamb of God, Who said,
“Whatsoever you have done to one of the least of these, My siblings,
you have done it unto Me.”
Even unto My little ‘sisters’.

No, the SDA ‘Sanhedrin’ voted to do that thing, anyway.
Christ was humiliated in the persons of all His faithful trusting siblings, by those who said,
“We have a law.
And by our Law those who claim to be, alike, and equally, children of God,
along with this faithfully-righteous Jesus, must die.”

. . . So you see, my wife and I are not leaving the SDA church, but merely allowing the SDA GC-rapists to leave us behind – on the Benjamite’s doorstep like the Levite’s soon-to-be-disected, divided and snail-mailed concubine – in their voted action of turning away from us, along with that Lamb of God, Who alone, bears and takes away the sin of the world. . . .

Here we stand. The SDA GC has abandoned and humiliated us.

Christ, on the cross, did not answer His faithless rapists other than to faithfully agree with His Father, “Let’s forgive them.They don’t realize what they are doing.” Then His Father became ‘Our Father’, when one small voice of a rebel who began to understand what was happening, dared to ask that faithful Lamb, Jesus,
“Will you be my King ?”

As the Israel-cursing Balaam was compelled to say by Jehovah,
“The people (ruled by God) shall dwell alone, and shall not be reckoned among the nations (not ruled by God).” “Let me die the death of the Righteous,” even in crucified humiliation, “and let my last end (posterity) be like His.”

And as the soon-to-be-Christian Ethiopian, ‘castrated’, ‘cut off’ Eunuch studied the suffering, ‘cut off’,’ ‘dwelling alone’, Savior of Isaiah with Philip in the jostling wagon, they soon came to the Sabbath promise of God – even to ‘Christian’ eunuchs with no hope of a ‘posterity’ such as He and that Suffering Savior of Isaiah both seemed to lack. Yet,

“For thus saith the LORD unto the eunuchs that keep my sabbaths, and choose the things that please me, and take hold of my covenant; Even unto them will I give in mine house and within my walls a place and a name better than of sons and of daughters: I will give them an everlasting name, that shall not be cut off.” ~ Isaiah 56

I believe that that Sabbath covenant-promise of God was the trigger that moved the Eunuch to say,
“Here’s water !
Humiliate me even more completely, then.
‘Crucify’ me, so that God Himself can raise me up as a good memory in His house of memories.
What a great deal !
Why not ?”

. . . and, yet, some dare say that the ‘Jewish Sabbath’ has no ‘New Covenant’ purpose for ‘Christians’ ! ?
Say it to the humiliated ‘New Covenant’ Christian eunuch of Ethiopia and to those castrated captives of Babylon – Daniel, Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego.
Say it to the humiliated SDA women pastors
. . . all whom know better.
‘Sunday’ has no ‘cross’, no humiliation of ‘self’. Therefore:

“For the bodies of those beasts, whose blood is brought into the sanctuary by the high priest for sin, are burned without the camp.
Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood,
suffered without the gate.
Let us go forth therefore unto him without the camp, bearing his reproach.
For here have we no continuing city, but we seek one to come.” ~ Hebrews 13

God did not willingly-choose to leave the camp of the idolaters at Sinai for the tent of the ‘moed’ appointed time and place, ‘without the camp’.
He was re-placed in the hearts of His own ‘people’,
by a toy god formed after their hearts’ own characters.

Jesus did not willingly-choose to leave the gates of Jerusalem for Golgotha.
He was re-placed in the ‘place of the skull’-hearts of His own ‘people’
– even by His own formerly-faithful Levite male ‘pastors’ –
by a toy god formed after their hearts’ own characters.
(‘We have no king but this world’s legally-voted king, Caesar’.)

At the borders of another ‘Promised Land’, another, ancient, vote was taken, and an overwhelming majority of millions-to-2 (Caleb the ‘dog’, and ‘Jesus’), voted to get rid of the old ‘Prophet’, and return to Egypt and the loser-‘Caesar’ kingdom, instead.
But, for 40 years that overwhelming majority enjoyed resting in dead wastelands.

“Neither be ye called masters (‘Mr.’,or ‘Mister’) : for one is your Master, even Christ.
But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.
And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted.
But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.” ~ ‘Joshua’, in Matthew 23

Thanks for listening to this story of how God’s own people get pushed out, ‘left behind’ and ‘dwell alone’ . . . by and from ‘god’s own people’.

It is a very old story, is it not ?

(William Noel) #75

Because of how many times I have seen the Holy Spirit empower people to minister in ways that obviously were not of human origin, including putting women in positions of spiritual leadership where they are ministering effectively, often more effectively than men.


You are not alone in feeling betrayed :disappointed_relieved:

(Elmer Cupino) #77

I have to give you credit for your passion but may I remind you that you can be more influential as an active member of the church and voicing your concerns than stepping aside and allowing those “rapists” to continue with their behaviors. Remember, it is not the church but church leaders that can lead others astray. Support your current pastor’s convictions. Be vocal.

(Red Livingstone) #78

Yes, it is. I can begin to understand your stance. I recognize the courage it took to take that position. God knows your heart, and a few of us on this forum are learning your beautiful heart. Thank you for being open and willing to share.

(Eric Webster) #79

Dennis, I appreciate your stand and I can understand the heart-ache of your wife and yourself. But I would join others in encouraging you to pause and reconsider your position. I was present at the Battle Creek meeting on October 14 and I feel the same way you do. But I believe you can do more for thousands of members if you and your wife remain members and help to support both men and women in the gospel proclamation. God will support you and He has ways of dealing with men in leadership who make wrong decisions.


Of course not !
Neither were the ‘7,000’ sinners ‘in Israel’ that simply could not find any ‘worth’ to ‘ship’ in Baal, and which lonesome Elijah knew nothing about.

But all of us ‘betrayed’-‘in Christ’, The Betrayed, and The Rejected by this world’s means of ruling by force, rape and humiliation, by this world’s ‘kosmos’-order, by this world’s own exclusion of the True ‘King of broken Hearts’ . . . are most definitely ‘alone’, as ‘Pilgrims and Strangers’ wandering in this deadly ‘world order’, along with a large, lonesome army of Abels, Enochs, Noahs, Abrahams . . . Rahabs of Jericho and Marys of Magdala.

As you know, Jones was inSpired to point out from inSpired Scripture just how the ‘Israel of God’ are in fact made, ‘separate’, ‘holy’ and ‘live alone’ as ‘overcomers’ among the ‘world’-majority – by God’s own holy, error-separating, cleansing presence becoming enshrined in their sin-ful, distrust-ful hearts . . . their Jerusalem-sanctuary ‘citadel of the soul’, ‘at the very foundation of the thoughts of the mind of the sinner’, etc. , but not by any of their own righteous ‘filthy rags’. Such sinners crave something worth ‘trusting’, worth ‘ship’-ing.

And, just so, it was possible for this craving in Jesus to make Him loneliest in a jostling crowd of dis-trusting, dis-trustful humans, while He would sacrifice the best of early morning sleep to find comfort, ‘alone’, with ‘Our Father Who is in Heaven’. ( “When the Son of Man comes, will he find trust on the Earth ?” ~ Jesus )

Abraham rejected Sodom seeking the same comfort as Christ did in ‘Christ’s day’ (’. . . and was glad’) that Lot rejected, for Sodom’s busy and financially-‘successful’, but violent, crowds. ( And, there were ‘holy’, ‘qadashed’ male temple prostitutes ‘separated’ to idol-gods in the area where Abraham remained, too.)

Lot was not a ‘homosexual’, he was simply too greedy, like the bored, lusty Sodomites who even attacked Lot and his Heavenly guests. Then Lot offered the Sodomites his 2 virgin daughters, instead, the same 2 who later got him drunk in order to commit ‘incest’ with their father by which incest was established ‘Ammon’ ‘My People’ and ‘Moab’ ‘From Father’. . . but those who are also too greedy to abhor and annihilate ‘Sodomy’, alone, from before their faces blindly turn those same faces away from these ‘other’ outrageous, power-grabbing lusts of ancient Sodom which they themselves may be imperfectly comfortable with, as was greedy Lot – even enjoying such ‘greeds’, themselves – in their self-blinded, and therefore self-justifying crusades against ‘non-compliants’. The ‘mighty oak’ is on deposit in the tiniest ‘acorn’ of greed-lust.

My wife and I are weary of being lonesomest in an SDA crowd that – now, clearly --rejects the same comfort that we are driven to seek along with those weary, lonesome ‘bankrupt’ of ‘chapter 11’, Hebrews. . . Isn’t it ironic-to-the-max that a ‘majority vote’ would find purchase in a ‘remnant church’ ?:thinking: