Causes of Disunity

(George Tichy) #41

No, no. Just my reaction to the tiring criticism that you constantly focus on accusing every teacher and preacher of incompetence. The only problem is that you never showed us (yet) the secret that makes YOU the only one competent to teach/preach - or one with authority to judge negatively and criticize every minister and teacher as incompetent.


By next week, there will likely be a committee for conveniently reporting that.

Adventists are tech savvy—they may even create an app, and a central website to compile data. That would be efficient.

Did you know that some churches even have barcodes for each member so they can track attendance?

To carry this to its logical, dystopian conclusion, Adventism could adopt the Chinese model for “raising the awareness for integrities and the level of credibility within society.”

The possibilities are endless.



Is it on the forehead or right hand?


Would KFC or Coca Cola share their secret?

3 can keep a secret if 2 are dead.

(Frankmer7) #45

True unity in the gospel can only exist with diversity of practice and thought, which is different from disunity and deviance. This is already seen in the NT. Or have you never read Romans 14:1- 15:7, or 1 Cor. 9-14? Or discerned the entire premise underneath documents such as all of Romans, Ephesians, and underneath Paul’s Torah free gospel mission to the Gentiles simultaneously with Peter’s mission to the Jews?


(Frankmer7) #46

His behavior on here is little more than troll-like, George. If he won’t share his secret, it’s likely he has nothing much worth sharing. I wouldn’t waste my time waiting for or even considering such secret gnosis from such a source.



(Kim Green) #47

I probably is…but I doubt that such “agape” love is going to be germinated with a more Fundamentalistic SDA church. The future looks bleaker and bleaker for the church’s growth.

(Kim Green) #48

They have because modern society has no room for them…no hiding.

(Kim Green) #49

"Similarly, could the current disunity in Adventism also be the result of a judgment of God upon the church? Perhaps prayers should be humbly directed at obtaining an answer to that question."

They (GC) already have the answers to what is causing “disunity” so they are not looking for any other “answers”. Fiat accompli.

(Kim Green) #50

It is because you have lived such a SHELTERED life…you know, living in different countries, speaking several languages, attending various denoms, working with various people as a psychologist…you know, you should REALLY get out more! :rofl:

After awhile, what he writes becomes endless nothingness…credibility is completely lacking with nothing but opinions to back things up. Yet another faceless LGTer.

(Steve Mga) #51

Dave –
God knew the heart of Solomon’s son and his friends.
God know the MOOD of the people.
God knew there would be a confrontation.
To prevent one [a pure REVOLT] God provided a Third choice.
Spliting of the Kingdom so that there would always be a “son of David”
on the throne.
And allow the other 10 tribes to leave and pursue a different path.
HOWEVER – God was STILL the OWNER of the 12 Tribes. They ALL
belonged to His Family, and He never let either group leave the Family.


In the forehead for the elites.

In the right hand for the proles.

Do I have to spell out everything, Gideon? :roll_eyes:

(Robert Lindbeck) #53

@gideonjrn unity can occur at different levels - you can have unity of behaviour, unity of thought, unity of purpose, or unity of belief. Each level requires a different level of submission. Unity of behaviour only requires me to submit at a behavioural level, my thoughts and beliefs do not have to be the same as yours, only my actions. Generally we call this uniformity.
Unity in belief and or purpose requires mental assent but does not require behavioural similarity. You can believe the same thing without acting the same way. Likewise you can be working towards the same purpose but in different methods.

What is the “agree” in this text? Is it behaving the same way? I don’t think so. Agreement is part of the mental assent of unity of belief or purpose. It is not uniformity.

I have to agree with you on this one. There are many SDA’s who never talk to or associate with anyone outside the bubble. There SDA churches that are mission focused, with strong relationships and ties to the community. There is an old adage…In order to have friends you must first show yourself to be friendly.

You might also want to add Job 28:28 to our study of Prov 9:10.

(George Tichy) #54

Ah, but there is a huge difference: KFC and Coca Cola have something inside, there is a content! They deliver, not only promise to.

(George Tichy) #55

I know, there is no magical content there. I am basically done with that nonsense.


When we Stepford Wives in the Headship church used to talk amongst ourselves about our Adventures in Submission, we’d say,

:anger: “Well, I’m sittin’ down on the outside, but I’m standin’ up on the inside!” :anger: :grimacing:

(Robert Lindbeck) #57

At the base level, what is compliance/obedience? Simply put, obedience is acknowledgement of a higher authority. Therefore disobedience is a refusal to acknowledge a higher authority. Obedience to God’s laws can only come as a result of being saved, never as a result of seeking salvation. We only attempt to keep God’s laws because we recognise Him as a greater authority.

In the case of the Unions v the GC, it is conditional acknowledgement - pertaining to the juridiction each has. A Union can obey with regards to one set of policies/rules/laws but not to another. Likewise, the GC should submit to the Unions on issues that lie withing the Unions jurisdiction. Compliance/obedience to one set of rules (ie tithe) does not equate to or necessarily require obedience/compliance (recognition of authority) in other areas. Disobedience (disunity) occurs when one body refuses to acknowledge the authority of another body, regardless of whether the authority flows up or down.

In the Adventist church, each level of the organisation has a jurisdiction that is not territorially based. Neither is it subservient to another level with respect to those matters. For example, if/when the GC starts determining who can and can’t become a member of the church, they are not acknowledging the jurisdiction of the local church and in fact claiming to be the higher authority with regards to membership.

Every time the GC reaches across the established boundaries of church jurisdiction they are eroding church governance. In most countries, each level of goverment is subservient to the next higher level. This is not the case with the Adventist church. The Unions and the Conferences have their own constituencies. The GC has no constituency. It does not need a constituency because it is a coordinating body, not a controlling body. This was the original intent. Each time it has strayed from this purpose it has sowed the seeds of disunity.

The greatest cause of disunity is willfull disobedience (refusal to acknowledge higher authority). The biggest example of this is the overreach of the GC across the established juridictional boundaries. Boundaries that were put inplace to prevent the GC acting like the curia and the GC President like the pope.

(Kevin Seidel) #58

Christianity has the gospel and it is not suppose to be a secret. It is supposed to be preached not hidden.

(Steve Mga) #59

Question –
To WHAT am I a Member FIRST?
A. The Seventh-day Adventist church.
B. The Church with its Headquarters in Heaven [not earth].

The Church in Heaven. Its Main Rule is LOVE.
Showing Love, Compassion, justice [which is how the Commandments are “Kept”].


What am I supposed to do on this gainsaying, insubordinate forum crowd…brag about how great an SS teacher I am, or the competent , insightful sermons I have presented at 4 SDA churches? (Opinion of listeners)

God resists the proud and SDA gainsayers throw stones at them even if they aren’t.