Christendom, the Police State, and the “Upside-down” Bible

The real riots will start when the four officers in Minnesota are acquitted. Beyond a reasonable doubt is a pretty high standard. The only reason the charges were upgraded to 2nd degree murder on the primary suspect and the other three officers were later charged was to stop the riots. The parroting of terms throughout this article such as “justice” or “police state” do nothing to address the extortion committed by the rioting crowds to commit a symbolic lynching of the officers without trial. Jury selection will be almost impossible as any potential juror has already concluded the suspects are guilty. This whole event in the end will further divide us and not bring us together.

  1. D. Trump’s holding the Bible in front of the Church has a symbolic effect based on certain deep ideology. American saga. I do not want to enter into that discussion. It is an extensive one based on the fact that American Christianity has underpinnings of another ideology.

  2. Dr. Hemmings obviously does not believe that the Scripture is the Word of God which is absolutely liberal neo-orthodox belief. It has opened the possibilities of modern re-interpretations of the Bible that does not fit the original divine intent of the sacred writings. If there is no sacred DEPOSIT of faith we have problem with the Church identity and purpose. Abuses of the Church are the wrong practice based on authority abuse, not ideological idols based on the “idol” of Scripture. Of course, Scripture needs to be interpreted all over again in every new generation, but not as it was explained by Dr. Hemmings who obviously belongs to a group of furious liberation theologians (reassessed recently even by the mainstream theological tradition).
    This is a subtle dismantling of the divine authority of the sacred writings and it is a dangerous call to base our beliefs and practice on the promptings of the so called Spirit via living logos (millions of possibilities of beliefs and practices). Only ignorant members will praise this so called liberation Gospel.

  3. I used to believe in liberation theology, not any more. It is a dangerous reshaping of the Christianity into a popular Christian Marxism. No wonder Antifa is part of that story. It has nothing to do with the original Gospel story and power. Social sins cannot be remedied by overthrowing the government. That is anarchy, not a solution. Read Martin Luther on peasant’s rebellion. You will be shocked!

  4. BTW, Clinton has been photographed with the Bible too. Ups! He is a Democrat. So no mention of that.


You think Trump is an anti-Christ? You know that he has not read the bible? Have you been with him daily to know this? Maybe it is more accurate to simply say that you are anti-Trump.
Actually, the democrat party as a whole is very anti-American, based on their values that are contrary to the bible, even if they do read it. Based on their hypocrisy I think they could be labeled anti-Christ too. Isn’t it amazing how Trump upholds biblical values more so than the democrats, whether he is a bible reading person or not? What a good man he is! He cares for us citizens. Works on protecting our country and its citizens. Works on making it possible for us to pursue life, liberty, and happiness. Can’t say that about the democrats. The dem’s are entirely about control and power, to the point that one can easily see the lack of honesty, lack of logic and common sense and such deep, deep dark underground works such as the Russian collusion delusion in a silent coup effort to undo an election.

seeing evidence like this makes me suspect that trump may really be on a fascist quest…his ties with the far right are unsettling, and the similarity in these photos is uncanny…it can’t be accidental…


I suggest that you read EGW’s accusations of Kellogg and his side of the story. As I recall, she and James originally rejected the Holy Spirit’s membership in the Trinity and His omnipresence. She wrote to Kellogg claiming that God had selected her as His financial steward and insisted that that gave her the authority to direct him to send her a large sum of the Sanitarium’s money (which would have violated his corporate charter from the state of Michigan). She circulated a testimony addressed to him accusing him of financing a building in Chicago and lying about it.

When it was proved to her that he hadn’t, she claimed that God showed her a vision of what he planned to build and she thought it was already built. As I recall, instead of apologizing, she initiated his disfellowshipping. Sad business.


ultimately KELLOGG fronted the church board and left the church

Poor misunderstood Trump. I wonder why he exclaimed, “My presidency is f----d!” when he thought his tax returns were going to be audited.

Is he planning to name his illegal jack-booted gang SS or Gestapo?

Putin must have read Goebbles’ books.


What do you mean by “fronted”? Did you mean “confronted”?

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this may not be useful outside of general interest…kellogg wasn’t and isn’t the most trusted source…

what is the difference?

what was the outcome ?

The difference is that they are two different words, with different meanings. I was just asking for clarity. I still don’t have the answer to the question that I asked.

No need to answer if you don’t want to…no worries.

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Please calm yourself. Dr. Hemmings made it very clear Scripture is the Word of God.
You do not know the original divine intent of Scripture, any more so than the next person can claim it, so please step down.
It is also near hilarious any SDA can argue so fervently against any modern re-interpretations of the Bible. Modern re-interpretations of the Bible are how the SDA church was founded. It’s like we forget our own history, over and over again.

If the church is putting the Bible over human value and lives, I think it’s fair to call it “idolizing Scripture.”
Also, again, hilarious to talk about dangerous promptings of the Spirit in a church which offers non-Biblical titles to men and not the same titles to women. Hilarious.

re: Clinton and a Bible
It’s intriguing you think Clinton holding a Bible is comparable to Trump holding a Bible. Please help me understand how you see this factoid as relevant.


Simon, I hope you understand what the word “Spectrum” means, since the role of this space seems to be just that - to accommodate a broader range of views and discussions that you typically not going to find in the church, or individual churches where these discussions tend to be dismissed… even though a large number of people in the pew had been pondering about certain objections.

If you want to live in a comfort-zone of ideological blanket with all of the assumptions and views that align with your current ones… do you think you ever will get to the truth of the matter? What if you are wrong? In that case your unchallenged wrong views will be perpetuated in such setting your entire life, and you will die being wrong.

If you are wrong about something, wouldn’t you want to know that? Well, that wouldn’t happen unless you get to listen and be exposed to wide range of positions that would challenge yours.


The government under which Jesus lived was corrupt and oppressive; on every hand were crying abuses,–extortion, intolerance, and grinding cruelty. Yet the Saviour attempted no civil reforms. He attacked no national abuses, nor condemned the national enemies. He did not interfere with the authority or administration of those in power. He who was our example kept aloof from earthly governments. Not because He was indifferent to the woes of men, but because the remedy did not lie in merely human and external measures. To be efficient, the cure must reach men individually, and must regenerate the heart. {DA 509.3}
Not by the decisions of courts or councils or legislative assemblies, not by the patronage of worldly great men, is the kingdom of Christ established, but by the implanting of Christ’s nature in humanity through the work of the Holy Spirit.


Why was he crucified then? The Jesus “movement” (uncountable crowds following him) taught things that threatened the power structures in both Judaism and Roman Supervision of Jerusalem/Palestine. Roman rule was ruthless, based on domination and unbridled power. For Jesus to teach that our ultimate loyalty belongs to the Father, that his disciples are to live by love as he lived, that they are to care for the poor and broken and be suspicious of unbridled wealth–that was not “liberating?” Liberation Theology grew out of a need that was not being addressed in Latin America dictatorships. It has its theoretical flaws and weaknesses, but it is not true “Marxism” at all.


Maybe @phil doesn’t know that, neither do I, neither do you.
One thing we all know thought (unless one is blind or in The Nile…) and it is that IF Trump ever read the Bible, it has had NO EFFECT ON HIM at all. His morality is the lowest - just check the story of his life; his word is worthless - just check the factual 20,000+ lies to the American people; his incompetence is blatant - just see the turmoil he put our Country in.
I could continue the list, but I would be just wasting my time considering your prior statements about Trump.

I think that not even the Bible would be effective in converting your great hero! “Heil Trump!”

And speaking of the Bible, regarding that photo-oops,

He didn’t know it was a Bible!
He thought it was a copy of his favorite mentoring guide,
"MEIN KAMPF":open_mouth::innocent:

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Jeremy, I am just reading William Shirer’s “The Fall of the Third Reich.” The similarities are just astonishing, AND SCARY!!!


you know, the only thing that keeps me from fully subscribing to the view that trump is deliberately pursuing fascism is the reality that this would mean he’s a reader, and a student of history, which by all accounts he isn’t…can someone really mimic so completely an historical figure, down to the way he holds a bible, by total accident…that’s the question…

on the other hand, trump’s no dummy…he knows how to play the race card better than anyone i’ve seen…he knows how to play the law, and congress, to where he’s getting away with what have landed others jail time…he knows how to cover his tracks, no question - think russia, think his taxes…and he knows how to play the media, and string along his victims to the point where they believe they’re riding waves of freedom, prosperity and greatness…even christians, of all people, are falling for him…

so the ingredients of a fascist do seem to be there…we can’t totally dismiss it…but he seems to be in the wrong country…i just can’t bring myself to believe that america can become fascist…

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Just imagine if the Republicans had the majority in the House! They appear to fully supoport him no matter what.

Yes, unlike Hitler, Trump is not a reader. It’s amazing how much Hitler read from crazy authors who proposed basically everything that he was for later on. Nietzsche, Goebels, and so many others. He had indeed a bright mind (genius??? :roll_eyes:) but was totally insane, evil, insensitive, and malign. He was a sick mentally man. But still people fell for his words without considering his behavior and acts. And they, along with the world, paid dearly for their stupidity.

Any similarity is mere coincidence, right?.. :wink:


I stand against Donald Trump’s authoritarianism, racism, narcissism, and ineptitude. He has helped highlight the moral bankruptcy of much of evangelical Christianity in America by his own. He is a wanna-be Mussolini or Hitler. He is running the ship onto that shoal. However, this photo of Hitler has been de-bunked. It is doctored. Go and research it. Just saying, zeal needs to be tempered in the name of truth and fairness…