Agree. There was no real threat at that moment. They keep talking about a knife. Well, where is the damn knife then? As far as I know nobody has produced any knife. Was there actually one, or is it all supposition that is used to alleviate the cop’s lack of self control?
In my opinion, one big factor was that the cop was frustrated for not being obeyed. The guy just ignored him. It was wrong, sure, but not a case for getting 7 bullets in the back, being unarmed. Occasionally I practice with my revolver, just to be in touch with the firearm. But I cannot conceive the idea of shooting someone because I am frustrated for the person not listening/obeying me. This would be nonsense from my part, and from any other person, including cops.
Well, I know I am adamant about my opinions. Please consider my background, of being a “behavioral scientist” (do you like the title?.. ) and I may see human behavior from a peculiar point of observation. But also remember. that it’s all just my opinion. Be well Tom!
George, ignoring the SRO against ̶v̶i̶c̶t̶i̶m̶ (PERP) from being in vicinity of girlfriend and/or children-after he violated said SRO by acosting her and taking her children in her car-which precipitated the call to 911 by the girlfriend-is utterly unhelpful in your opining that the officer shot him simply because you believe the responding officer shot him because the perp did not obey him. I’m certain you have not assessed said officer. But, that said, usually you parrot mantra he was shot because of color.
HAD the perp driven away with the minors (note too perp is charged with sexual abuse) and the children been injured because of the officers failure to secure their safety from this threat, what would you say then? Would the mother have a case against-and the officer/jurisdiction be liable-for said failure?
We aren’t sure about that. There are more things about this case that convinces me it shouldn’t be lumped together with what happened to George Floyd. I think there was more justification in this case. I think if I had been in a similiar situation where the woman reporting the domestic violence and calling the police claiming Blake was armed and dangerous, I my have been more apt to do what the police did. But it seems like all reason and getting to all the issues involved in these situations are thrown to the wind. The only thing that matters to some people, the suspect was black and the cops were white. To hell with the details. At this point I can’t see cooler heads prevailing to try and not judge the situation too quickly.
But one thing is certain to me. Trump should skip his planned trip to Kanosha. I can’t think of a thing he could say that would calm the situation.
Agree on that. I am not sure he will be able to convince people that he really cares about people. His trip may trigger a major crisis there since people will see him as just “pretending.” Which will certainly be an accurate perception. Will see.
You might want to reconsider this POV. I took a 6 month forensic psychiatry rotation during my child & adolescent fellowship while at UMass. I was assigned to the Worcester Family court and did family evaluations before cases were heard in court and supervised by the psychiatrist who wrote the textbook on forensic psychiatry. In the past almost thirty years of psychiatric practice, I have NEVER given an order for crisis workers to present to homes without police escort because I know first hand the danger and suicide/murder rates of domestic disputes.
I wonder how many of the members of this council have had real first hand experience in evaluating and formulating domestic disputes.
It’s true. There is virtually no more hazardous call than a domestic dispute. This one was exacerbated by the violation of a restraining order, the taking of children and a car without permission, and an outstanding felony arrest order against an armed suspect. Does it get any more difficult?
It is not uncommon for patients to claim “I’m not suicidal anymore” or “I’m not homicidal anymore” but threats as these are best treated by providing evidence for being able to maintain safety instead of promises. Anger does not dissipate in thin air for no reason and in a twinkling of an eye. The risk of danger increases gradually but steadily as one risk factor to another is met. Unfortunately the public only knows the last event that triggers the outrage and then passes on judgement on simply the last event. I have met with police officers and court personnel and that is not how professionals assess danger. It is always horrible when one dies in cases as these but we live in an imperfect world and that is why we need the rule of law. The simplest way to prevent unnecessary escalation is for all to adhere and obey the law.
Full disclosure. I am not white but a minority. I have never used my status to escape the long arm of the law. I know of a number of colleagues who routinely use their status to evade the law. But I bet I sleep better at night than they do.
I am very disturbed by the comments I have seen on this site. This is supposed to be a “Christian “ site dealing with moral issues of the day, yet I am truly alarmed at how our society, and even our churches morality has devolved so rapidly into a “stand your ground” mentality. As for the young man who was shot in the back 7 times while trying to enter his car. There were three officers, all with their guns drawn walking around that car, and you are honestly trying to tell us that they couldn’t have subdued this unarmed man in any other way than to unload a gun into his back? I find it disgusting that anyone would even attempt to rationalize this shooting as justified. You cannot look at the video, which we have all seen dozens of times, without asking yourself, why the only action that could be taken was to unload an entire clip at extremely close range into his back. I don’t care if he was a suspect or not. It will never be known if he would have been spared this horrific outcome if he had been white. What is disturbing is the insane lengths that many people, even on this site, who are supposedly concerned about higher moral values than those of civil authority will go through to rationalize this shooting. I don’t even know what charges prompted the police to apprehend him to begin with, but they are of absolutely no consequence in this case. Apprehension and unloading a gun into this unarmed man’s back are two entirely different issues. One should play no part in the other. We, as a society, go to great lengths not to torture, or brutalize even the most hardened criminals, such as when we put someone like a McVey to death by lethal injection. Yet, we seem content to justify taking a life if someone is not cooperating, never mind, not honestly posing any kind of threat to the officers involved. For any of you trying to rationalize this incident, you seem to be saying that this relatively small unarmed black man presented to three armed officers with guns drawn, such a threat, almost as if he were a superman, who could only be dealt with using the most extreme measure, shooting him with a lethal weapon. Everything seems to have devolved into an absurd set of what we as Americans value.
The current leadership of this country has carried us across the threshold of an unacceptable moral equivalency. Make no mistake, there is no moral equivalency between things and a human life. Some of you would have us believe that a person’s life is of less value than a 7-11 or a Walgreens store. If we acquis to this kind of logic, we will accept the notion that the young 17 year old who went across state lines toting an assault rifle with the intent of “protecting a supermarket or a used car lot”, when any honest person knows that he went to this extreme effort so that he could have an opportunity to shoot someone, which he did. Argue if you will, but deep in your heart, you have to know that the intent of this young man was not for the protection of people or property, it was to have the opportunity to shoot someone who he considered an enemy, which he did twice. Two young unarmed men will never take another breathe because of his twisted thinking. He was never in danger. He had a lethal weapon and they both were unarmed. The notion that he was threatened, when the video blatantly showed him tripping over his own feet is absurd. But we are now at a point where things have become more important than human life. It is amazing how far we have fallen in such a short period of time.
I am broken hearted as to how far this country has fallen and to some of our fellow church members who seem to have willingly been dragged down with it. Black lives matter, human life matters, things will always be destroyed. But they can all be replaced. People cannot be replaced. Look at the recent hurricane in Louisiana. Thousands of buildings were destroyed. We call it an act of God. By the logic of many on this site, it would be appropriate to arm yourselves and form a militia to go after God. Sounds absurd, but why isn’t that a natural progression of your convoluted thinking? I wish I could say that it’s alright, because God will ultimately judge all of us…but, at least for the moment, it isn’t enough.
That would be an interesting/revealing piece of information.
I worked for 12 years, a full time job, providing therapy for Court ordered perpetrators of Domestic Violence. I even developed my own set of 52 sessions for group treatment - both in English and Spanish. Total of 1,860 people graduated from my groups. Thus, I fully understand what your challenge to that group represents. It would be interesting to know what their “therapeutic” approach is…
First, in reading “Conscience and Justice Council,” I thought it was some committee at the GC working on equality, women’s ordination, etc. Big mistake though…
Lindy perhaps you should inform yourself of the specifics of why the police responded to this domestic violence call, and some of the issues surrounding the suspect before you fire off guilt trpping those of us who looked more specifically at the situation at hand and determined that the police were justified in their reaction. As for the white vigilante youth, you will get no argument from me there.
) and I may see human behavior from a peculiar point of observation. But also remember. that it’s all just my opinion. Be well Tom!