Courage and Presumption

Thank you.
Are you an Adventist at this point in your life? Just curious how this fits with the SDA doctines, if in fact you are still attending.

I’m not SDA, just as an FYI.

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We have deemed liquor stores, pot stores, and, oh yeah, walmart, as “essential.” In California, even daycare centers are open. You read that right: daycare centers. In fact, they are encouraged to stay open. So, it is about fairness. The Bible never says Christians should give up their fair political rights. The Apostle Paul demanded to go all the way to Caesar. In New York, police are allowing crowded parks in White neighborhoods…and closing down and ticketing people in The Bronx. Eventually even liberals will demand their rights, as they should have all along.

ok, so who do you think has a bigger influence with evangelicals, or is everyone just doing their own thing…i think joel osteen is also quite big, but i’m not sure he’s as involved in politics as pat…

How are you identifying evangelicals. Are you referring to a subset of Christians?

by evangelicals, i mean christians who downplay the OT, and who hold to only nine of the Ten Commandments…typically they draw a big distinction between the old and new covenants, and see no current value in the way god led ancient israel…specifically, they overlook the fact that the NT book of Hebrews teaches a heavenly sanctuary and priesthood that can be understood from Moses’ sanctuary and the aaronic priesthood…this leads them to put much more emphasis on christ’s sacrifice on the cross than his application of that sacrifice in the heavenly sanctuary…in fact, christ’s sacrifice on the cross is all that matters to them…they have no real use for christ’s priesthood in the heavenly sanctuary…

[quote=“cfowler, post:20, topic:20127, full:true”]
I’m well aware of Pat Robertson and CBN. I don’t think that the 1,000,000 number is that much of a wow, considering how many Christians there are in the US. I don’t think he’s much of an influence, in fact, quite minimal.[/quote]

[quote=“cfowler, post:20, topic:20127”[/quote]

I agree. When he speaks extemporaneously he sometimes exercises either an extreme lack of judgment or perhaps signs of dementia. Recently in response to a radio question he stated that it was reasonable for a spouse to divorce a spouse with Alzheimer’s since that disease is sometimes like a death. I imagine each time he reveals his lack of self-control, more and more evangelicals become less enchanted with him.


Hopefully no one here listens to Doug Batchelor.


a lot of people in our church listen to him…i think he’s got some things right, but he’s looking at things through a conservative slant, and so he isn’t seeing the full picture…

but this is where we are now…everybody seems hunkered down in one slant or another, whether it’s in society, or our church…


Where have you been Jeremy. This isn’t the first, nor will it be the last time, cynical preachers blame gays for natural disasters. Pat Robertson did the same thing after Hurricane Katrina in 2005. I heard Doug Batchelor say basically the same thing at campmeeting in 2008 about the horrible lightning storm that ignited vast forest fires in northern California that summer.


[quote=“Pierrepaul, post:11, topic:20127”]
The question for the SDA church and its members is the following: “When will we admit that the Sunday Law prediction is a failed prophecy?” - another 20 years? 50 years? 100 years?
Long before I left the church 4 years ago, I had criticized the church’s habitual fanatic focus on Sunday Laws. It has become a career of many in the SDA church to focus on every disaster or proclamation by the Pope as a sign that Sunday Laws are just around the corner. Just how many times will they cry “WOLF”?


Jeremy, you forgot to insert the word, “demented.” :innocent:

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Vantage point? What is your country? I may consider becoming your neighbor… :roll_eyes:

I know people who may fake the disease in the hope that their spouses will divorce them. Then, they will be miraculously cured… and “life goes on”… :laughing:

Bachelor and Robertson are “holy competitors” for the, “The Craziest” trophy… :laughing:


probably what’s really going on is that society is getting used to preachers blaming sinners for natural disaster…it will be easier for society to believe that sabbath keepers are to blame for the seven last plagues, when they come…

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I think that 99% of the people who hear this, just roll their eyes. :roll_eyes:

The number of people who believe this kind of lunacy is very, very minimal.


And what will be the accusation? How are the charges gonna be described? Oh, I see:

“I am sick because you kept the Sabbath last week!”


What if the cross
were the apple tree?
Two sons, both naked.
One claiming “not my fault”,
and enrobing self in guilded figs,
and running like an orphan spurned.
The other not claiming anything
-except sonship.
Presumption to believe my blame assignation is as good as my sartorial skills.
Courage-to love each the other as kin, brothers, sons of god

true, but when the real thing happens - when sabbath keepers are blamed for the seven last plagues - it will seem legitimate because everybody’s used to this kind of scapegoating…

well, the way i understand it, it will actually be demons - including the false christ who’s staged the second coming in different parts of the world, and who’s performed many documented miracles - making the accusation…leave it to demons to think up something convincing…

Jeremy, now I am becoming afraid of those “van demons”… :innocent: :innocent:

The problem with your theory is that it cannot be proved biblically; I mean, the details you mention are creations of the human mind. Therefore, they are mere fantasy. But I am speaking only for myself.


George, @vandieman is still drinking EGW coolaid on end time events.

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