Do You Really Want to Know?


(Tim Teichman) #244

No argument from me on this.

You’re not a very good Adventist. :slight_smile:

Why yes, yes he did, didn’t he? Very timely information, this being New Year’s Eve :slight_smile:
Now let’s see. Do I have any wine around here somewhere…?


(George Tichy) #245

It always amazes me how so many people believe in things that are not in the Bible, often the opposite of what is in the Bible.


(Tim Teichman) #246

For example, there seems to be more than a few very clear passages regarding the dead that make no sense if the dead are literally asleep. How do we manage to ignore them so completely?


(Cfowler) #247

I’m quite certain that there are plenty of present SDA members who participate in eating meat, coffee, and masturbation. I don’t think many people have left over not being able to participate in these activities. They just do it, along with engaging in lots of other activities and lifestyle issues that EGW condemned.


(James Peterson) #248

It’s interesting that list. :slight_smile:

That came out of the blue. The usual complaint I hear is about a salfivic Sabbath and the doctrine of an IJ and the summary dismissal of any “different” ideas.

//


(Cfowler) #249

Agreed. I think if all the people who participated in one or more of those listed activities left the SDA church, there wouldn’t be many left!


(Tim Teichman) #250

Strange isn’t it? And I will bet that a whole lot of our single 20 and 30 somethings aren’t virgins either. Like 90% of them. Shocker.

I went to the movies the other day. I figured I’d give my guardian angel a break while she waited outside the theater. Maybe chat it up with the other guardian angels for awhile.

Assuming going to the movies is bad, is it OK to stream the same movies at home on my new giant flat screen TV? I did get it for myself for Christ’s Mass. Ellen doesn’t comment.


(Cfowler) #251

You’re very thoughtful, Tim. I know the angel appreciated it…even angels need breaks, I guess.

Did you know that EGW says that angels guard the grave of William Miller? Yes, it’s true…she says so in Early Writings. How bored are those poor angels. That has to be the most dull assignment ever! I think the question is, why does his grave need guarding? :thinking:


(Cfowler) #252

I’m sure none of them drink either! :sunglasses:


(Johnny Carson) #253

Exactly so. Truth hurts, so we continue to go with the lies we comfort ourselves with.


(Kim Green) #254

Ironically, Carol, the one person that is obligated to work on a Sabbath- is the Pastor! :smile:


(Kim Green) #255

"I love my wife, I don’t beat her not because it’s a cumbersome rule even though the law says that I cannot beat my wife. I keep my hands off of her because I love and respect her and doing the things that she likes is a pleasure for me to do, not a burden. The same is true with God. I love the sabbath it is both my pleasure and honour to spend that time to honour and spend time with my maker. If you want to call that legalism that’s all on you, because it is nothing but love that propels me to keep the sabbath just like it’s love that propels me to do."

Just as an aside…is there a difference between the “love” that you have for your wife and the “love” you have for the Sabbath?

"So many people talk about the sabbath like it is some grievous burden, that disturbs me to no end. What was burdensome was the quagmire of sin I was drowning in before Jesus rescued me. To me the sabbath is a delight, a joy the highlight of my week."

First off…I am happy that you are in a better place in life. Do you believe that everyone here has had the same experiences that you have? Have you had the same experiences as the rest of us?


(reliquum) #256

Well, they are kickin’ that nefarious strong drink masquerading as Soya-
Kool Aid.


(reliquum) #257

If one accedes that the first sabbath in eden was defacto honeymoon, it might help these two loves conjoin.


(Johnny Carson) #258

@cfowler @timteichman @cincerity and others, regarding the “rules” – movies, masturbation, Sabbath breaking of one kind or another, failure to believe in one or several of the 28 fundamentals. I can’t help but wonder why it is that even in 2018-2019 so many people seem to focus on those things, not for themselves, no, but what they see others doing or think they are doing.

Talk about reasons to leave via any door available…

I’ve decided that I don’t believe in any of the 28 fundamentals, except maybe one, and I’d have to look at the list to decide whether there might be one or two more that I could add to my list. They may be true… or not… but are they necessarily or are they always of a salvational nature? I think not.


(Kim Green) #259

We shall see if that is the “interpretation”. :wink:


(Kim Green) #260

No, I don’t believe that they are “salvational” at all. They never have been but with the exception that if someone truly believes that they are “salvational” for them (they are). :slight_smile: We can usually make nearly any biblical text work for something we believe in…just read the above comments. Just think, when Jesus died there were very few “rules” but Man has created scores of them to follow. This truly puts “rules” in the place where Jesus should be.


(Kim Green) #261

Oh…Happy New Year! :smiley:


(Johnny Carson) #262

Indeed! Happy New Year to everyone :slight_smile:


(Frankmer7) #263

I would say that according to the NT letters, Gentiles were not to be compelled to come under the law and practice Judaism. This was the issue in Galatians, as well as Romans.

But, Paul never forbade Jewish believers from practicing these things. In matters concerning food and holy times, possible references to the sabbath and kosher, he said that each person should be convinced in their own mind. Again, I believe the problem was the compelling of others, namely Gentiles, to conform to the same practices as necessary for covenant membership, rather than leaving such matters to individual conviction. Paul’s direction for the observant and non-observant was that they should welcome one another as Christ welcomed them…with their differing convictions and practices.

Ignatius’ labeling of Jewish practice as being monstrous for one who believed in Jesus, goes beyond what the NT and particularly what Paul was saying, and starts to border on anti Semitism, to me…even if he lived and wrote this in the last portion of John’s life.

Thanks…

Frank