Hooey and Credulity


(Spectrumbot) #1

Editor's Note: This is the November 5, 2018 statement from North American Division President Dan Jackson following the discussion and vote to bring the amount of tithe sent by the NAD to the General Conference into parity with the other world divisions within the next three years.

I think we are done for the day. Now please come tomorrow with your running shoes, because we have a lot to accomplish tomorrow. I want to make a statement before you get up.

I want to make a statement that is very sensitive. But I am saying it to you, and I don’t know if we are streaming still. It doesn’t matter if we are, or if we are not. I think the discussion of the last two days demonstrates a malaise in the church. I believe that all of us need to pray that we will overcome that malaise, or at least the spirit of God will overcome that malaise in the church. We must appeal to God to bring us together.

I will say from the perspective of serving as the president of this division for eight years, that I am very tired and probably angry at the way our division is looked at by the world. (Amens from the audience.) We are not rebels. We are Seventh-day Adventists (Amen). There is tremendous loyalty to the church in the North American Division. Once again, I would challenge — and I mean challenge — someone to find any of the divisions that are more loyal to the church, both in terms of policy and finances than the North American Division. I will not sit here and tell you what I know, because it would be embarrassing to the world church. But if we have two unions, or 49 women who have been ordained, these are small matters compared to some of the other matters that exist around the world (Applause).

I don’t know where the discussions will go that we’ve just voted, but I will tell you, there had better be a spirit of reconciliation on the part of all. No condescension. No, we are not your students. We are colleagues together in ministry with our brethren from the General Conference. Period. It will be unacceptable to the three of us, as it is unacceptable to you, that you’re looked down upon. It’s just not acceptable. I will not tolerate it, and I mean that just as I say it. I will walk away so fast it will make anybody’s head spin. This division has not only been the breadbasket, but it has been the source of human resources that have fanned and fueled mission and growth and development in the world church for decades. And I hope and pray it will continue to be. I hope and pray that we can come to an amicable resolution of the financial issue that is pregnant in this division. Because we don’t live in the days (breaks into song) “The days of wine and roses.” We don’t live in that world anymore. We just don’t.

And so, I am making this statement so that you all know, and so our world leaders know, and my good brothers, my fellow division presidents: Be a little careful. I’m not saying this militantly, I’m appealing: Be a little careful about how you talk about this precious division. And the precious people who lead in this division (Standing Ovation).

I want Jesus to come (Applause). I expressed some time ago to Elder Wilson, following the 2015 General Conference [Session], these sentiments: “I know that you believe we are on the borders of Canaan. I don’t believe that. I believe we are headed back into the wilderness.”

We all bear a responsibility here. We have got to stop talking about the brethren like they’re scumbags. We must pay respect, give respect, and appeal that we work together. Condescension isn’t pretty on anybody. So, by God’s grace, this has been a serious period of time these last two days. And we still have some territory to cover.

Punishing people is something that God ultimately will do. In my opinion, and I know this steps on toes, I will never agree to that document (Applause). It was voted by the world church. There was a majority vote. And the General Conference will have to apply whatever principles it needs to apply or it thinks to apply. Because you see, you understand, the North American Division has never said we do not think there should be any accountability. We have never said that. As a matter of fact, as I said the other day, we offered a way through by request from the president of the General Conference. We offered a way. It was rejected. So what I’m saying now is that I am praying that God will give us the collective sense to assist us to find that document in the paper shredders (Laughter).

If God is with a movement, it will prosper. If He’s not, it is doomed to failure. I just have a very hard time believing that women are doomed to failure who are guided by the Holy Spirit (Standing Ovation).

I believe this church, this doesn’t sound pretty, but I believe this church will one day in the future is going to stand up in embarrassment and apologize for the absolute abuse of women. (Applause)

I am not talking about — you know, people have different opinions — and I want the folks who think right now that I’m an absolute raving lunatic, to know I support your right to believe women should not be ordained. I support your right. You are a member of God’s church. You are our brothers and sisters, and I’m not talking about that. I am talking about words entrenched in policies that beg credulity. You can’t tell people today, “We love everybody, and everybody can do everything, except those positions that require…” Get that policy out of there. Just come out and say, “We do not believe in ordination of women. Period.” That’s all you have to say. But that nonsense, that hooey (Applause), in the B60 policy that allows us to put a noose around the neck of women is garbage (“Hooeys” from the Audience). It’s a good word. Don’t say three times, “We love everybody, and everybody’s acceptable, and you can do anything, except if there’s an ordination requirement, and then come to the end of the policy and say all of these ‘except’ statements in parentheses do not apply - and do not apply them - to women who have been ordained as elders as it has been voted by the General Conference.” I’m sorry it begs credulity.

Our women in the North American Division who serve as pastors and leaders will be protected by the North American Division and every conference and union president in this place (Standing Ovation).

There is more hooey — there is hooey in the male headship theology. It was never Seventh-day Adventist, it is not Seventh-day Adventist, and it is not going to become Seventh-day Adventist. So, here’s a story. My good secretary just said, “Calm down.” He’s a good man. You know, we will continue to pray that God’s spirit will lead the church, so that our women will not be held back or limited by glass ceilings that we have created to in order to protect our own positions (Applause).

So, I just wanted to tell you a thing or two at the end of the meeting (Laughter). I know there will be some folks who will be madder than a hornet with me. And my basic statement is that if you are mad as a hornet, “Buzz off.” Because I have to tell you, I have lived through this for eight years and I am tired.

Let us determine by God’s grace that we will work: a) to support our women, that we will work — and this is painful — in harmony with the brethren, because that is part of our role, and the brethren around the world have said, “No.” So the onus is on us to demonstrate that our women are spiritual women of God serving Him, building ministry for Him, and we will not pull back. We are not going to quit a) hiring women pastors. If you feel we’re going to, or you’re going to kick up a fuss about it, too bad. We will not stop. Furthermore, we will continue to agitate for the ordination of women to the Gospel ministry.

Having said all that I have said in the last twenty minutes, I want to say: I have made an issue of this, because of the last two days. But this division, having said that, is not about Women’s Ordination. It’s about evangelizing the world with the Gospel of Jesus. And I don’t remember who it was, I think it was Todd Pascoe, who said we need, no, it was our brother from Columbia Union, we need to find new ways and new methods of evangelizing for Jesus Christ.

Some of us will do that believing in Women’s Ordination, some will do that not believing. I’m appealing to all of us, let’s touch each other, let’s work into each other’s hearts. We are brethren, or we are the bristers, you know? You know what a brister is? That’s a combination of a brother and a sister. We are the bristers (Laughter). And we must work together. We have, and will always have, some impediments, but let us not be deterred. Let us move forward in our mission and with joy in our hearts — not anger — but joy in our hearts because the Lord Jesus, who came as a baby in a manger, is going to come again. And He wants us to live with Him, and with each other, forever.

And you know what I know about heaven? There’s not going to be one argument about women’s ordination. It’s like we used to say when I was a pastor: “There are good things about every period in history, for instance, the time of trouble, there will be no Ingathering.”

God bless you.

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WATCH NAD President Dan Jackson’s Personal Appeal Here:

Image: Flickr.com / NAD / Mylon Medley

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This is a companion discussion topic for the original entry at http://spectrummagazine.org/node/9181

#2

Amen.

Thank you for your spine of steel, Elder Dan Jackson.


(Vinjar Fonnebo) #3

This is a good and appropriately strong statement. Next, we need to know which tangible measures the NAD will take to make sure the voted Battle Creek document never will be relevant for North America. I hope this clarification comes today…


(Robert King) #4

Oh Danny boy, the pipes, the pipes are calling
From glen to glen, and o’er the mountain side
The summer’s gone, and all the roses falling
'Tis you, 'tis you must go and I must bide.


(Thomas J Zwemer) #5

A man who is true to duty as a needle to the pole. Brains, Heart and SPINE.


(George Tichy) #6

These are the words of a true leader. A person of integrity who will not bow down to the inquisitorial actions planned by the GC.

In 2010, after I heard TW’s first sermon after his inauguration, I wrote right here at Spectrum that the Church train just stopped and the backwards gear was just engaged. And yes, we have been going back to the wilderness since.

The only solution for this crisis is to get rid of those who are creating the crisis, visibly the GC crowd. I hope 2020 will be the “year of getting rid” of those fake leaders by voting them out. The whole crowd! The best would be eliminating the GC completely, since it is a totally irrelevant agency anyway! If one disagrees, so just tel me what is the GC good for!

Go Pastor Jackson, GO!!! Keep leading us!!!


#7

…Which means what?


(George Tichy) #8

Oh… those incompetent teachers again… they are so imprecise and vague, aren’t they?.. :innocent:
I believe the NAD sends 6% of its revenue to the GC, while all other Divisions send only 2%. The idea is to stop this practice, and bring the NAD’s contributions down to 2% as everyone else.

Maybe, just maybe, the GC will start understanding the “money language”…


#9

It would indeed make them compliant


#10

Hooey. What happened to Dewey and Louie?


#11

Actually that is a good question, what did happen to them…lol


#12

Yes, competent teaching is clear, concise, cognitive, character converting communication.


#13

I remember Ted Wilson and Jerry Page speaking at the church I attend.

Also I remember Dan Jackson being there at another time. He was there for Sabbath school and sat 1/2 way back next to the center aisle. I made my usual minimal nonsense comments, in class, and didn’t notice him there until class was over.
Would have been nice to tell him how incompetent the SDA preachers were and see his reaction. I did talk to Jerry page and gave him some notes and met Ted…but didn’t have much to say to him.


(George Tichy) #14

I am sure nobody here would say this about your “unending, repetitive comments on incompetence,” but I bet those people you mentioned certainly had one word popping up in their minds, … “annoying”… :innocent:


(Thomas J Zwemer) #15

Where has Kevin been through all this?


#16

Yes , a very effective teaching approach, especially for, “need of nothing”, know it all, thick skulls.


(George Tichy) #17

LOL… are you really missing his dissertations? Maybe he will come soon to “interpret” all those things so that we can (finally) understand them… :roll_eyes: :innocent:


(Thomas J Zwemer) #18

His spin could shed light on Ted Wilson’s mind set. But maybe it is only gonadal expression. It beats me how Good News could be limited in its sharing. If even rocks would cry out. A great theologian summed up his message with the words of a child’s song. “Jesus loves me, this I know for the Bible tells me so.”


(George Tichy) #19

There are many rocks crying out even right here!
Dan Jackson is certainly a big bolder crying out right now!


(Cherry) #20

Thank you Dan Jackson!!! Now you have earned a nice long vacation after all the recent church political shenanigans!! Stay well! We need you!!!