Benny Hin and Robert Schuller have also claimed God’s blessing, but I don’t believe it. Success is not always indicative of the blessing of God. However, I would not pass judgment on the Chinese. God takes us where we are and will bless our best efforts, while trying to lead us to a higher plain.
This type of misogyny and repression is exactly why most millennials have decided to stop being part of this corporation.
Remember that here in the NAD we are not united. The tithes of conservatives and liberals alike go to the NAD. How dare you think it’s just about you? The conservative voice in the NAD is being ignored in my opinion. But our voice is growing!
It is OK for you and thousands of other NOT TO WANT to be a Pastor. I want to assure you that THAT is OK. But WHY would you WANT to engage in promoting a policy which would keep OTHER Women from that goal?
In the 1860s and 1870s it was believed it was WRONG for Women to become Physicians. But one brave Woman became one. Now we have Women Physicians in all the physician healing disciplines. A friend of my daughters in an ER physician at Loma Linda. Would you have said back then Women are NEVER to be physicians and have done what you could to prevent that, even though YOU did NOT want to be one?
It is OK for persons like you to not want to be in certain professions, but WHY be part of a Legislation Process that PREVENTS others from fulfilling THEIR Dreams?
Makes NO SENSE!!!
It really is not that hard to understand. Although men and women are of equal worth - God has assigned different roles to each of them. That is in line with God’s order. The Son testifies of His Father and the Spirit testifies of the Son. But all three all are equal. It is only hard to understand if you insist on reading the Bible through the lense of contemporary western culture and are determined to make it conform to the requirements of that culture.
Christ was not concerned about cultural relevance. He came to establish an entirely new order of things. All these efforts to seek to make the church more “relevant” will in the course of time make completely irrelevant as we will have nothing to offer the world that they do not already have or cannot get elsewhere.
As for the treatment of Jan Paulsen - that was not right I agree. But neither were the racist and disparaging comments being made on Spectrum’s livestream against the African delegates.
Much introspection is needed on both sides. Although on this issue one side is presenting a Biblical position in contrast to a extra-biblical one based on the shifting sands of modern culture.
For the simple fact that WO is not biblical. If it’s not biblical, it’s not biblical. Simple as that.
This is a sad day. In the 21st century how could such a thing happen? They say Jesus only chose 12 male disciples. They forget they were not the “head disciples” They were only the first disciples. Jesus said go and make everyone disciples–male and female. We as Adventist always say that we are all disciples of Jesus. I will maintain until I die that this issues is not theological. It is sociological. The theologians are using scripture like the Sunday worshippers to “prove” their point, and that is including the president of the GC. This is a sad day. But it will not end. Women one day will be ordained. It must not end. Their will be “agitation.”
but no where in my Bible does it tell me
to which SDA church entity
OR EVEN WHICH DENOMIMATION
I should donate my funds.
Please show me the text which states that
the SDA General Comference should be a
recipient of my funds?
The Bible only tells me to donate ten percent!
For many decades I have given far more than the
Bible requires, and whether I give it to
Frontier Missions, or for a new pipe organ
for my local church, or to feed the homeless,
or to Doctors without Borders,
(one of the most dedicated humanitarian
organizations on the planet),
I know that God appreciates my generosity
and will consider EVERY PENNY, a gift to HIM!
Malachi reads to Bring ones gifts into the Storehouse.
But in THIS day and age, WHICH Storehouse? That is the question.
And that IS the Question on many sites on my Facebook.
MONEY in relationship to the Vote in Wednesday.
I believe, at least in the short term, the unintended consequence of THE VOTE will be, for some, a shifting of their money into various “storehouses”. 1. Other Conferences. 2. Local Church Budget. 3. Community people helping projects.
These are ALL places persons on my Facebook are considering.
An angry backlash with their purse is being considered.
The NAD doesn’t ordain anyone. Ordinations are the domain of unions.
Stay tuned to the GC session, perhaps especially tomorrow. Fewer & fewer delegates are showing up. There will be spelling out of the implications of the down vote on division variance. There’s great likelihood of attempts to limit the unions in contrast to the function that EGW wanted for them. Already today at SA, Wilson was praising Doug Batchelor & (Danny Shelton’s) 3ABN.
There is no such thing as gender apartheid. I mean seriously…
Something to ponder is why the NAD and the divisions that already “commission” women are also the most evangelistically stagnant. And why have the churches in the west that have adopted WO experienced only further declines in active church attendance following this decision?
Fidelity to the truth brings success in ministry. However out of sync that truth may be with the prevailing cutlure.
I really believe the millenials are leaving our church because they don’t see members in our church having victories over sin in their lives. They see a powerless religion with people pretending to be christians. They are not fooled. We need to be real at home first, exhibiting Christ with each other and then in our churches and thus to the world. There are many who go to church for generations who need to be born again.
So, all those who are opposed to WO hate women? Pretty far-fetched, I’d say, since many of them are women themselves.
Maintain as you will…
The principle of male headship is biblical. WO is not. It i sociological as you say.
It is the proponents of WO that are reading the Bible as the Sunday Worshippers do. Do your research on the historical critical and culture driven hermeneutics these people use. They have no basis in the Bible. They are wholly extra-biblical and are not a part of historic Adventism. These hermeneutics made their way into the church when our theologians started attending non-Adventist seminaries as many of them continue to do to this day. The logical result is
they are bringing all the wine they picked up in those place and are putting to the lips of their brethren to make them as spiritually intoxicated as they are. (Excessive, inappropriate, judgmental. - webEd)
This is how religion is negatively perceived and ridiculed by the world often, when it lags behind society in issues like social justice which it should be in the forefront, dragging societies along as fast as it can. Yesterday was not a vote to stand up to some Biblical principles or teachings, it was clearly a stand to continue it’s backward ways and allow the church to be seen as an instrument of oppression against women. This vote wasn’t going to force any church to have ordained female pastors, but allow those who wish to do so. I am ashamed that in this generation, we still feel the need to use whatever means possible to justify oppressing others needlessly. Until this church wakes up to it’s calling to be a light unto others, it will never be blessed fully by God. If angels sing praises in heaven upon the saving of one man, they surely weep yesterday.
Have you ever thought that evangelism does not work very well in a country that values equality and freedom? We are not reaching people in these more secularized countries because they see how morally backwards we are and want nothing to do with us. Yes, immigrants from other countries where women are treated like second class citizens may not mind, but we can no longer reach the educated citizens of our country. That is why we need female pastors here - it is not that our female pastors are looking for honor.
Evangelism does not work in the West because they have watered down our message to the point of irrelevance. All in the name of becoming more “culturally relevant.”
People are looking for something different. I have seen it, in N America, Europe and Africa. And the distinct Adventist message has a drawing influence.
What is needed is to educate people about the truth - not the misrepresentations spread abroad, willy-nilly and left and right but those on this forum - that God created all, both men and women equal. But this fact does not deny that he has specified different roles for each. And this order is consistent with God’s character.
The real issue is we have not been converted. We have not internalized the truth that Christ came to establish an entirely different order of things and not to pander to the fickle and shifting demands of contemporary culture.
One big difference between people is how they decide what to believe
1 - because someone you trust tells you
2 - because it confirms something you want to believe
3 - because repeated experimentation fails to disprove
1 Makes you a Roman Catholic
2 Makes you a Protestant
3 Makes you a scientist
Why do you believe your explanation for millenials finding the SdA denomination not worth staying in/joining?
That, Birder is not true. That the priesthood was corrupt, we do not know. And what we know was that the pharisees were in that regard quite decent and to be trusted.