Here we go! Since the GC is completely irrelevant and inefficient for anything else than politicking, what about eliminating it for good? I have been proposing it for many years. I wonder how much money would be saved if that worthless agency went just … “pooofff”…
In case you forgot (memory problems?.. ) , I already stated it several times:
Church For Sinners Only
(Not a place for “saints”)
Thanks for the reminder…just having a “senior moment”.
However, I think that there are those commenters that would fall into the “Church Of Perfection” that would not be eligible for your “Church For Sinners Only”. Just saying.
Oh, the “already perfect guys?” We would hand them the address of another church down the road, the “Church Ready for Rapture.”
Not far from the church they belong to now, the “Church Ready for Rupture”… …
lol…like that one, “Church Ready For Rupture”. Springing straight from your fertile imagination…so expressive and wonderful!
Oops, you missed an important point or I did not clearly state the point if you did send offerings to an Adventist church. “If you are an Adventist then your response implies an attitude of resentment and offerings sent by you might not really be considered offerings at all but rather obligations of payment.” This is to mean that if you were to send offerings to an Adventist church with the attitude you displayed in your comment.
This portion of my comment is not relating to giving offerings to another church. Sorry about the confusion.
I think that on this forum one of the rule is to not make such judgemental statements pointed at other posters.
On the other hand, compliments are welcome.
For example, I like @ezbord’s post. Thanks Robin!
And, do you rent out your house on Maui? If it’s ever safe/proper to fly again, I’ll be going there for a break.
Have they investigated into why this happened, while the economy and the markets were so great?! (Presumably their more wealthy members have been making bank for the last decade of bull markets.)
Hint: Could it be because the church is stuck in the 19th century, and refuses to budge? Could it be that their policies, such as abject discrimination against women and LGBTQ+ individuals, which seems outdated to me and my generation (in our ~50’s), seems completely unacceptable to my kid’s generation? Or is it their insistence on nonsense “scientific” positions (a subject they have no business delving into) that is alienating? Or is it the relentless focus on Jesus’ “soon” return, which Paul started 2000 years ago (he was wrong, too)?
No, I doubt it. It’s not any of those things. Carry on as doing what you’re doing. Everything will be fine. Nothing to see here…
May be too little to late. It is likely that in the short term church attendance will suffer resulting in less tithe income. I think that, we as a church, like the title of President and Vice President, which removes authority from local church and creates office staff positions. Power in tittles is intoxicating.
I’m very out of touch with SDA young adults. I’m aware of the importance of WO and LGBTQ issues these days. But, I think that the SDA church needs to also admit, that a lot of people of all ages have left over the doctrines, i.e. Sabbath is mandatory for Christians and is the end times test, EGW is a prophet (and all of the rules, etc. that flow from here writings), the SDA church is the remnant spoken of in Revelation, and other doctrines that aren’t in line with the New Covenant.
I don’t think that this will ever be admitted, publicly anyway. But, surely behind closed doors, there must be, at least a few people, who actually know this to be the case. I made a comment to Monte Sahlin on the AToday FB page a few months ago, that people leave because of doctrine. He basically pooh-poohed that idea (I don’t remember exactly what he said). But, I just find it so hard to believe, that in private, at least a few people are not in denial over this issue.
I am sure that they are aware that some leave because of doctrine, etc.
What I have seen with younger people is that they stay within Adventism but don’t particularly put any stock into EGW. She really is less and less relevant to many of them even if they go to church on Saturdays.
Yes, I’m sure they know that some leave for doctrinal reasons, but I don’t think they want to admit, or know, that it is probably a pretty substantial number. It’s easier to chalk it up to being hurt, or not wanting to live the lifestyle.
I don’t know how many have left for doctrinal reasons, but I think it’s quite a bit more than they would ever want to know about.
I saw this on the Oregon Conf site. Thought this was interesting, and not part of the report from Spectrum
There are about 37,000 people registered as members of the Oregon Conference. A bit more than 1/3 of those attend church regularly. That gives us about 12,000 active members, or somewhere around 8,000 family groups.
So, 12,000 active members in the conference. I wonder how many of those 12,000 are over 50?
There is the ever-present thorny issue of not removing members that go to other churches as well to muddle up the count.
Not sure if they keep stats on age groups precisely…but they well might have some ideas. Would be interesting to know for sure.
I like the title “Sinners and Saints”.
If one reads Paul carefully, he has a Very Low Bar for those reaching
Romans 1, those that were doing the “Law” without knowing they were
keeping [doing] the “Law” were declared to be Saints by God. And
accepted as a “Saint”.
Notice there has been a RISE in the number of Administrative
and other Conference Employees.
More than the % of Rise in membership over time.
Perhaps The SDA church conferences and unions are MORE
interested in baptisms into the SDA church than Baptisms into
the Christian church – meaning more members volunteering in
Community programs, meeting more people one on one, and
inviting them to Meet Jesus.
Getting SDA members AND Pastors to join in already established
programs by other churches and groups has been an impossibility
A number of years ago I had a 5 foot by 3 foot Seventh-gay
Adventist sign made. It has been in the Atlanta Gay Pride
Parade quite a number of times.
I have friends who attend Atlanta Episcopal church. They
participate every year. I walk behind them with friends helping
to hold my banner.
I get FREE Beads from the Episcopalian friends to throw at the
One year there were some attendees at the parade from Southern
[had on T-shirts]. They waved really excitedly. Another year an SDA
girl ran out into the street and took our photograph as a souvenir.
So true… even in my Texas environs.
In my time as an SDA, the “others” were wrong and “we” had no need to join them. They should join us. They didn’t have the truth, we did. End of story. Besides that, there could be uncomfortable food issues, maybe other things (jewelry, music, etc) that might be uncomfortable for Adventists, or the issue of the day on which the activity might occur. Sometimes doing something with other Christians would be viewed as a mission outlet. You know…so they can become one of “us”. I’m aware that some people aren’t so concerned about these issues nowadays, but I also know that those attitudes are still there, to be sure.
You ask “ Do I rent my home in Maui ?
No, because it is in a gated community that prohibits
short term rentals.
Secondly, I do not need the rental income.
But Tim, you are welcome to be a house guest
any time, free of charge!