Restoration of the Sick and the Lost

An interesting task would be to see HOW MANY verses in the Psalms are Complaint verses. I have never done it, but there ARE a lot of Complaining the Psalms. LOL!
Maybe our Jewish King really knew how to pray!
Are Adventists REALLY just New Testament Christians when it comes to prayer?

By the way at synagogue last PM we had a great study about Hanukkah.
One story about when Antiocus asked the man with seven sons to sacrifice a pig. Each son from the oldest to the youngest said no in turn and each was killed in turn. The wife was killed, and then he was blinded. IN modern days in Iran Christian girls some as young as 9 refused to be be sex toys for Islam men. Each was beheaded.

It’s not only in Iran that women are treated as second class creatures and discriminated against!


What astonishes me most about this thread is that nowhere, either in the essay itself, nor in the 21 responses that have been made so far, has anyone mentioned what I consider the most important reason for… and definition of… prayer. Which I find stated most succinctly by Ellen White when she say, “Prayer is opening the heart to God as to a friend”.

That ties into, but is quite different from, the comment in the essay about reading the 23rd Psalm “differently”… for I find the most applicable phrase of that Psalm to the “hard question” we are considering as being the central portion where it speaks of the Lord leading… and even in the “valley of the shadow of death” being with me. It is that companionship that is important to me personally… the sense of the Presence of God through every moment of every day.


Here you go, Sirje. The Window - Leonard Cohen

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Thank you Tony.

I guess a simple thank you won’t do. It has to be 20 characters or more to post. :slight_smile:


Yes, this is one of the problems of limiting ourselves to thinking of God as “trinity”. It is so easy to forget that God is Spirit… and as such is fully capable of being with each one of us individually all at the same time. But while God is Infinite so it is true that we “can’t know God in his reality” and are limited in our understandings to finite analogies, that does not limit God in HIS ability to relate to us. This is where “trust God” becomes a way of life, not merely an intellectual admonition.


one of egw’s statements on prayer that has really influence me is:

“It is a part of God’s plan to grant us, in answer to the prayer of faith, that which He would not bestow did we not thus ask.” Great Controversy:525.

to me, this virtually says that we can influence events as they unfold…if we don’t pray, events unfold according to god’s will…but if we do pray, events unfold according to god’s will AND our input…i think this is such a staggering thought, it’s hard to take in the privilege this potentially gives each one of us…

this wonderful power god has put in our hands, as i’ve come to learn, comes with conditions:

A. sinless living.

“if i regard iniquity in my heart, the LORD will not hear me”, psalms 66:18…

“therefore pray not thou for this people, neither lift up cry nor prayer for them, neither make intercession to me: for i will not hear thee”, jeremiah 7:16…

B. a feeling of contrition, and a realization of need.

“blessed are the poor in spirit: for their’s is the kingdom of heaven…blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted”, matthew 5:3-4…

“for thus saith the high and lofty one that inhabiteth eternity, whose name is holy; i dwell in the high and holy place, with him also that is of a contrite and humble spirit, to revive the spirit of the humble, and to revive the heart of the contrite ones”, isaiah 57:15…

C. faith.

“but let him ask in faith, nothing wavering…for he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed…for let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the LORD”, james 1:6-7…

“but without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to god must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him”, hebrews 11:6…

“…verily i say unto you, if ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you”, matthew 17:20…

D. perseverance, luke 18:1-8; 1 kings 18:41-46: matthew 26:38-46…

prayer is one of the great gifts we have, this side of heaven…strictly speaking, nothing cannot be solved with prayer, prayed by someone who fulfills the conditions…even when circumstances themselves don’t change, we are changed to deal with these circumstances effectively…

I am interested in getting replies from those who attended a live SS class yesterday (Dec 20th) as to what portion of the 30 minutes to 1 hour were devoted to discussing the theme of the last 2 verses of James which is alluded to in part 4 of this article. As one can see , so far there is virtually no discussion/posts on it.

James 5:19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him; James 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

Notice the trend has been to analyze/scrutinize the issue of human/God vertical communication and yet discussing the outreach/altruistic mindset is left unmentioned.

Anyone notice, like I do the tendency of the SDA church to neglect that theme and to promote the tendency to turn SDA members into ones like Jesus mentioned in the story of the Good Samaritan…Pharisees/Levites who wouldn’t lift a finger for the suffering and stay exclusive?

I have noticed this emphasis for 4 decades. This is why I share with any guest pastor who speaks at the local church I attend to refer to Gospel Workers P 196-199

James previously addressed the issue of lip service vs action

The last lesson of this quarter will be off James texts yet deal with the gospel.

People can’t share the gospel if they don’t know what it is or have a false concept of what it is.

I am hoping that Alden writes an article for the next lesson…

This is why the LGTers are constantly in big trouble!


We never made it that far. The rest of the lesson was stimulating enough that we were lucky to make it to verse 18. However you make a good point. The problem these days is that few are willing to admit that they are in error, no matter how compelling the evidence for truth is. I think you might know a few folks who are in that category, yoyo. :wink:

I believe I’m correct in saying that Jesus spent a lot more time articulating truth than He did actively combating error. He did combat on error on occasion (such as when the Sadducees had a false concept of the afterlife), but mostly it was presenting the truths of His word.

Quite right, Birder… and not only that… he spent a LOT more time “articulating truth” than he did in promoting error… Like LGT etc…


Observation: I notice that this anti-LGT posting seems to be spreading like Bermuda Grass.

Since the editors review the posts, I would be interested in seeing a knock down drag out fray, debate/ fight with… first some poster who has the reputation as being a SUPER-PRO LGT proponent state in pithy/succinct statements or EG White quotes what is the specific, unpopular stance of that persuasion that irks so many of SDA, including Randy Roberts. Then the anti-LGT crowd rebut with why it is so detrimental to ones relationship with God and others.

AND I don’t mean on the Sabbath school threads, I am referring to the very visible NEWS site.

I wouldn’t.

(Post must be at least 20 characters)


The very fact that a hardline supporter of LGT wants a “knock dwn drag out fray, debate/fight” over the topic of LGT demonstrates very conclusively that LGT does not produce the “fruit of the Spirit”… nor does it reflect the Love that Jesus showed and even commanded his followers to reflect.

So sad.


Let me guess which position you would take in a “knock-down” fight over LGT.



(why 20 and not 22 characters?)

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Restoring the sick needs no explanation, but exactly who are the Lost?

What are the chances that there will be an article on lesson #13?

Check out the first page of the lesson. Is the gospel as stated = to “salvation by faith”?
Now there is some truth to that yet…where is Jesus?
Where is the substitutionary death?
Where is grace?
What about John 3:16, what about the resurrection?

If one wants to share the everlasting gospel…do they just knock on doors and say, " U R saved by faith"

What does saved mean?
What does faith mean?

Are there 31 ways to share the gospel since people are all over the map on experiences?

We obviously need more Fundamental Beliefs to explain all those issues.


Well, it’s Sabbath and it appears that the lesson on the GOSPEL got missed due to lack of interest.

I hear often about sermons being presentations of the gospel and we need to spread the 3 angels’ message and share the gospel…

I will challenge any reader to ask your class and pastor…“What is the gospel?” and see that most don’t know and it is evident because of the diverse responses.

Next quarter is on Proverbs…

Foolishness and fanaticism continues, stay tuned. (Excessive. Why not make some positive contributions? Keep this up & we will throw you out of here. - webEd)