The Legacy of Martin Luther’s Sola Fide

Exactly! Agree with you.

The path to Christ is not a law, any law. It’s the CROSS and what it means (“It;s finished”). There is so much involved with the Cross event; it’s in my opinion the core of the spiritual experience that one has to go through in order to come close to the heart of Christ.

Then, there is the Gospel, so clearly enunciated in the Bible in a way that whoever is willing to listen to it will easily understand the message.

The Law has its place, sure, but it is not what attracts people to the Savior. Look what the result of following the Law was among those people that followed the OT Law, the Torah - and they were eagerly expecting the Messiah’s appearance! How did that work for them?

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2 Cor 3: …You are manifestly an epistle of Christ , ministered by us, written not with ink but by the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of flesh, that is Christ toward God.

… our sufficiency is from God who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, … how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious?

No ceremonial law was engraved in stone.

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The comment was about Galatians, Sirje.
Galatians is about circumcision and the ceremonial law.
Stick with the passage being discussed.

As for our friend, George Tichy, what value is the cross if the law was not violated. Kind of an inane comment, isn’t it George?

Just curious Bill, which part of my statement do you see differently? No value in the Cross? Was it not finished (as the LGTarians preach)? What is it?

Inane” (Dict)
in·ane: silly, foolish ,stupid, fatuous, idiotic, absurd, ridiculous.

Really Bill?

@timteichman

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I believe this applies as well:

2 Cor 3:14
But their minds were blinded. For until this day the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament, because the veil is taken away in Christ.

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Your comment differentiating between the “moral” law and the “ceremonial” you apply across the board in you post. The OT makes no such distinction. The entire law is considered by Paul, to be the “schoolmaster” which disappears when the Christian is baptized in the Spirit - as John predicted.

AND, who says Galatians is only about circumcision? There’s a whole section explaining the function of the LAW - Gal.3:15ff. which includes this statement: therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith… This is an on-going process for the Christian who has accepted Christ as Savior. The law is always there, but it does not save.

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I’m glad you pointed that out. It caught my attention as well. That veil is still in place with some of the SDA teachings.

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Hmmm, were there any gentile Christians in that church because I need to see where they were taught these laws given to and known only by Jews? This subject was dealt with in Acts and Hebrews where it is clear the old covenant was no longer binding on the new and not to be cherry picked as SDA often do.

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There isn’t a better verse applicable to SDA IMO because of their stance of THE remnant church and “spiritual Israel”.

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Hebrews helps us see the mental agony that occurred with the
Jews when the Temple was destroyed, when the religious services
of cleansing from sin were no longer available, and when there were
no longer any priests to provide these services.
It was then that the " synagogues" with the Rabbis was put in place
by the Jews.
What Hebrews is telling ALL that past religious services of cleansing
from sin in the Jewish Daily and Yearly means no longer matters
because Christ lived, Christ died, Christ arose, and is NOW in the
Most Holy place forever, sitting NEXT to God the Father, whom BOTH
of them are offering forgiveness of sins, and by the power of the Holy
Spirit to change lives so one is committing FEWER sins.
There is NO LONGER a “veil”, a Separation from God. We do not need
an earthy “Priest” to mediate for us. No more animal sacrifices, no more
penance of works. When we worship we are already “in the presence of
God”, WE are standing around the Ark of the Covenant when ever we
desire, and NOT just once a year like the High Priest only was under
obligation.
Christ was in the “Most Holy Place” [whatever THAT IS] since the
ascension to heaven.
John in Revelation says there is no Temple in the New Jerusalem.
GOD and CHRIST the Lamb are the Temple. And this was written
only a few decades after the book of Hebrews was written.

Hebrews was very late in the Time Line of the Letters written by Paul.
Romans, Galatians, etc were written a lot earlier. That is why all these
Letters do not encompass everything that Hebrews does.
All these other Letters were written to both Jewish Christians, written to
both Gentile Christians at the SAME TIME.

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Steve, isn’t Hebrew a fascinating book? It’s a summary of the whole process of redemption as performed by Jesus according to the Divinity’s plan. From the beginning to the end of ages. From the Eden to the Cross, with the final “It’s Finished.”

It’s sad that the SDA Church does not officially support the whole message as presented in the book, but rather comes up grafting some extraneous branches into the tree of the Divine Gospel.

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OK, guys. The obvious seem to be obscure to you.
Even when it is clearly explained. Actually, you contradict each other, but doesn’t seem to bother your “unity” to attack the obvious.

So I’ll let you bicker among yourselves with your “higher enlightenment” that is really mass confusion.
When you can explain to each other what you mean, that will be a unique situation not apparent for now.
Take care.

Oh no Bill, please don’t leave without referring back to my post #24 above. You need to clarify that. Maybe then we all will understand “the obvious.” :+1: :wink:

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Thanks to y’all here in Spectrum I took a closer look at what I
thought I knew about Hebrews.
It isn’t EASY reading all the Scriptures with ‘new eyes’. One’s
brain keeps forcing one to put on “the old glasses” and read
and understand as one was taught in Religion classes long ago.
But I’m learning. It is SLOW.
PS–My Friday evening Rabbi in his homilies has also taught me
much about the Old Testament and emphasis on the Torah.
Makes it easier understanding Jesus the Man, and understanding
Paul the Christian Rabbi.

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Wait, so are we united or bickering?

I know, we explained it.

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Let me ask this Question which my brain just ask another part
of my brain.
IS Revelation ONE Letter. Or is it made up of other smaller
size Letters to the 7 churches. And eventually all of them
incorporated into One Document so none of the Letters
would be lost?

Yes, the idea that we are still under the law, minimizes the requirements of the law. It’s not just about doing the best you can. The requirement is for perfect law keeping in both thought, intent, and deed.

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Covers the words of parts of Exodus, Leviticus, Deuteronomy.
All aspects of one’s spiritual, personal, community life. In addition
to one’s relationships with the Creator.
Minute and detailed instructions.

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Yes, which is impossible and so Paul writes that it is a bankrupt proposition.

Paul writes the following. I find it beautiful and wish it was taught from the pulpit in SDA churches:


"So again I ask, does God give you his Spirit and work miracles among you by the works of the law, or by your believing what you heard? So also Abraham “believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness.” [before the law existed]

"Understand, then, that those who have faith are children of Abraham. Scripture foresaw that God would justify the Gentiles by faith [after the law was fulfilled], and announced the gospel in advance to Abraham: “All nations will be blessed through you.” So those who rely on faith are blessed along with Abraham, the man of faith.

"Before the coming of this faith, we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian. [we are no longer under the Law]

"So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

“What I am saying is that as long as an heir is underage, he is no different from a slave, although he owns the whole estate. The heir is subject to guardians and trustees until the time set by his father. So also, when we were underage, we were in slavery under the basic principles of the world. But when the set time had fully come, God sent his Son, born of a woman, born under the law, to redeem those under the law, that we might receive adoption to sonship. * Because you are his sons, God sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, the Spirit who calls out, “Abba , Father.” So you are no longer a slave, but God’s child; and since you are his child, God has made you also an heir.”

"It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery. [the Law]

“Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised [put yourselves under the law], Christ will be of no value to you at all. Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised [puts himself under the law] that he is obligated to obey the whole law. You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace. For through the Spirit we eagerly await by faith the righteousness for which we hope. For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. [follow the law or don’t. It doesn’t matter.] The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.

Paul - Selections from Galatians 3 - 5


*Note that in New Testament times & culture the adopted son was held in higher esteem than the naturally born son. The adopted son was chosen and would often receive the inheritance even before the firstborn son.

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