George, Elmer
When does the PUSH for Unity become a Dictatorship?
At least there are no “concentration camps” for “re-education”.
In 1870 James White declared there were 5 Seventh-day
Adventist Doctrines that were “generally believed.”
And everyone was in “good and regular standing.”

In 150 years all that has changed. The Spirit of the Pioneers
is no longer a part of the leadership of the church.

As Andrews University pointed out several years ago,
One CAN go against SDA doctrines [and get into BIG
trouble] while attempting to do good in the neighborhood.
[Assisting a housing program in Berrien with a few $$$'s]


Well Spectrum certainly plays it’s part in the polarisation.

With such a rich vein of choices to criticise, particularly at the GC level, the regular but unnecessary joinder of church politics with US national politics and the continual pivot toward sounding more like a left wing college paper does not help.

There is no doubt that church politics and national politics may be running on parallel tracks but conflating the two has doubled down on the tribalism you would probably purport to avoid.

Money changes everything…the NAD controls the purse strings. It is also the sandbox in which TW lives. There is much that could be done. It has more to do with our will to make the necessary changes.

1 Like

Lynden –
We people in the pews have very little to do with what happens at the
Union, Division, General Conference level.
Everything is controlled by “Managers” at the various levels.
Committees – The “Managers” ALL decide at ALL levels who will be
on what Committees.
We, the people in the pews, have no control over Committees. That is
why More than a Million over a long period of time was spent in studying
Women in Ministry. Was voted on. And then ALL the Committee Reports
were TRASHED in the dumpster.
Other Committee actions that would have devastated our Universities
was Approved, Announced, and then TRASHED. All that time and money
All that money for those Voting Machines at SA2015. Persons refused to
use them.
It was a “committee” that came up with that Double-Talk statement about
Women Ordination at SA2015. The way it was worded, even those proficient
in English Language would have no idea how they were Voting when Voting
either Yes, or No.


I was talking to a female church worker, which told me that she could not be " called " to work in her Union, because she is married. The Union however has no issue with " calling " married males. They say it is easy moving a male than a female, because she has a husband and children, like the other doesn’t have the same. Also, female workers don’t get benefits, like housing allowance, medical aid, school allowances, etc. They also don’t hire females as permanent staff, and they don’t get pension, that is only for males.

So what is unity!!
Does unity imply being abused or does it imply being treated as an equal, getting the same opportunity as the other, or be treated as an inferior. Once we remove discrimination that exists in the church, then we can start to work together, that doesn’t mean that we will always agree, but at least we will reflect the character of Jesus Christ.


Please, until hypocrisy, discrimination, and unfairness are eliminated from our midst, let’s not talk about unity. It would be insane!


Amén!!! We need to stop and reflect on what is actually happening in our community of faith, and stand up against the error which is being proclaimed as " truth ".


The elephant in the room here may be the expectation that Ted Wison will work to control the NAD after the current president’s retirement by influencing the choice of his successor.


I believe your source is giving you information which you should verify, Carlo.
A woman cannot (legally, per church claim) be ordained as pastor-and therefore is not considered as a GC VP, or president. I believe all the other rights are permissible for women-albeit perhaps grudgingly.

It would be surprising if he did not.

I believe that outside of the USA, church policies which would affect these things can be wildly out of compliance with generally accepted standards. The GC gets reports about noncompliance out in the world church regularly, but chooses to focus on only certain issues, to avoid upsetting the apple cart among the overseas base.

1 Like

There IS a woman GC Vice President. She is in the Education Dept.

Oh, this is already in the works, I am told. The next NAD President may already have been chosen. Now the formalities have to take place, like for example, … voting… :open_mouth: :wink:


Yes. A “Committee” selects who they want on the Ballot.
Usually only 1 [one] name.
I don’t know that there are any “down” votes by a delegate.
Not very smart to do so.

Division presidents are by definition called GC Vice Presidents. There are as well at least one other (i believe 3? presently?) “General Vice Presidents” of the GC. It’s another issue entirely to consider presidents or vp’s of other departments (edit to add, who additionally are not required to be ordained-which obviously would preclude her). BTW Lisa is my cousin, Steve. Her dad was a VA psych from Hawaii, who married into my moms extended Finnish family.

1 Like

I never mentioned ordaining female workers, and I talking about female workers, accountants, etc. One forgets that what might be the norm in one country or Union or division, doesn’t exist in other parts of the world.

Many years ago, one of my friend worked as a secretary for a conference in South Africa, she told me that she did not receive a salary sometimes at the end of the month. They send her a bus allowance to travel to work, but her salary was not constant.

Now, in 2020, men get the golden egg as church workers. We must not confuse truth with lies.

1 Like

I didn’t mean to imply you did, but to work in higher church levels (even accountants at one time) were ordained.
So, for women to function in all roles equally, she would require it.
That’s why i brought it up. Essentially what you mention here is wrong, and counter to church policy and accepted practice.

The squeaky wheel gets the grease. Keep reporting it.


A great find!!
thanks! I shared it on my Facebook.

1 Like

The irony is that when religion went to the world they told them this is God’s will, in fact it was taught to them as the only way it can be. They would have accepted a true Christology, that all people are created equal. But sadly, the very characteristics you referred to are still prevalent here.